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PostPosted: Mon 16 Jul 2012 13:22 
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Staff Stellar Impact

Joined: Mon 22 Aug 2011 15:19
Posts: 361
Hi all,

There is some news about the Science vessel straight out of our hangar.

This ship has mastered the art of electronic warfare and gravitational forces to take control of its opponent’s ships.

The various skills of the Science Vessel in operation are:
- The pulse wave: The ship generates a large pulse wave in which the enemy ships are repelled.
- Electronic warfare: The ship is equipped with electronic combat systems which cause the enemy ship to lose control.
- The distortion bomb: jewels of technology, this bomb can create distortion rifts. All ships of large tonnage suffer extensive damage in contact with it.
- The Tractor Beam: Used at first to tow ore asteroids, the military application of the tractor beam can attract enemy ships. This allows to pull out a threat in an armada.

Finally, recent research allows the science vessels to carry a gravitational singularity advanced module. This singularity attracts nearby enemy ships, inflicting more damage to them as they approaches the center.

This technological gem will come into your hangar on July 26 th. This is the latest news from our construction yard.

This ship will be accompanied by a series of changes to the game.

The towers surrounding the respawn area has been enhanced to fire on multiple targets at once.
Several skills and abilities has been fixed and tweaked. For example, deployable structures cannot be stacked anymore.
Settings and graphics optimization has been made, especially regarding the fog of war.
Other improvements and adjustments are expected.

All these changes will be detailed in the patch notes of the July 26th patch.

Thank you for your patience and I'll try to answer your questions about the new ship or changes.


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PostPosted: Mon 16 Jul 2012 14:15 
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Joined: Sun 17 Jun 2012 18:51
Posts: 26
tyraelius wrote:
lectronic warfare: The ship is equipped with electronic combat systems which cause the enemy ship to lose control.


That sounds like it has the potential to be incredibly frustrating. Nobody likes to just 'lose control' of their game. How exactly is this mechanic going to work?

tyraelius wrote:
The Tractor Beam: Used at first to tow ore asteroids, the military application of the tractor beam can attract enemy ships. This allows to pull out a threat in an armada.


Is this going to be a skill shot? How can it be countered? Resisted? Will it be harder to pull objects that are a.) heavier and/or b.) moving faster?

If the tractor beam is too effective or too easy to use it will definitely break game balance. A skill that causes an enemy to overextend could easily become an 'I-win' button.

Biggest thing I think we all want to avoid is another launch like the Carrier or Arty, where the DLC addition is so overpowered that the game becomes unplayable until it's fixed. Obviously balance eventually reached a good place with both (kudos for that!), but those initial periods were horrible. Better err on the side of caution -- I'd rather have a weak addition that needs to get buffed than a game breakingly powerful one that needs multiple nerfs.


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PostPosted: Mon 16 Jul 2012 14:46 
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Staff Stellar Impact

Joined: Mon 22 Aug 2011 15:19
Posts: 361
Hey Hurleybird,

I'm gonna try to respond to your interrogation,so

hurleybird wrote:
That sounds like it has the potential to be incredibly frustrating. Nobody likes to just 'lose control' of their game. How exactly is this mechanic going to work?


Well, the player will loose the maneuverability of his ship, but he still can fire and use his skills. The duration of the skills is quite low. so you won't be able to send a player in the deep space. ;)

hurleybird wrote:
Is this going to be a skill shot? How can it be countered? Resisted? Will it be harder to pull objects that are a.) heavier and/or b.) moving faster?


The heavy ship will be particularly sensible to this skill. the speed or the evade skill will be the most efficient against it, as hard counter. If the tractor beam exceed his max range, it breaks.

The Science vessel is in test right now, but its skills won't change.

Have a good day.


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PostPosted: Mon 16 Jul 2012 15:24 
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Joined: Sun 17 Jun 2012 18:51
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Tyraelius:

Thanks for letting me "interrogate" you. Just want to make sure we don't repeat the mistakes of past DLC ship launches ;)

tyraelius wrote:
Well, the player will loose the maneuverability of his ship, but he still can fire and use his skills. The duration of the skills is quite low. so you won't be able to send a player in the deep space. ;)


Good to know. It really needs to be low though. Like two seconds at max level. Even two seconds heading in the wrong direction will all but guarantee a kill in larger matches. I'm assuming that losing control means you can't adjust speed or turning. If it's just turning and you can still stop yourself then I guess the ability becomes less potentially problematic.

tyraelius wrote:
The heavy ship will be particularly sensible to this skill. the speed or the evade skill will be the most efficient against it, as hard counter. If the tractor beam exceed his max range, it breaks.


It seems like you've only described soft counters (unless by "evade skill" you mean Quantum leap or accelerator?)

Here's the issue: No soft counter is going to work when people start to combine tractor beams and stasis field (or electronic warfare for that matter). You need hard counters. Quantum leap could be one, as it makes sense that physically re-positioning one's ship would break tractor lock. Force field could be another hard counter, as it would make sense for the tractor beam to be unable to penetrate the bubble. Using shock-wave or gauss shot against the science vessel could be another hard counter. Ditto jammer. Besides range, you could also have a chance to break free of the tractor beam based on mass*speed, or just doing enough damage to the science vessel itself.

Quantum accelerator is a soft counter obviously, but you can defeat it with stasis. Perhaps accelerator should hard counter stasis and then we don't have that problem? (not to mention stasis is a bit problematic as it stands... never should have been made effective against quantum leap :( )

Lastly, you could have the science vessel incur a penalty on itself when it uses the tractor beam. It makes sense that if the science vessel is trying to "tug" another ship that it would also lose some degree of speed and maneuverability itself -- and maybe a greater penalty for tractoring heavier objects. That being said, if a penalty is added then there should be a way to deactivate the tractor beam prematurely in case it gets you into trouble.


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PostPosted: Mon 16 Jul 2012 16:19 
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Joined: Sat 1 Oct 2011 13:56
Posts: 310
"The towers surrounding the respawn area has been enhanced to fire on multiple targets at once."

If this is the only anti-HQ rush change, I don't believe that it will make any difference.


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PostPosted: Wed 18 Jul 2012 04:28 
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Joined: Mon 30 Apr 2012 03:26
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Watsong wrote:
"The towers surrounding the respawn area has been enhanced to fire on multiple targets at once."

If this is the only anti-HQ rush change, I don't believe that it will make any difference.

Yeah, you can sit in the middle of the turrets and still kill, I did it earlier today.


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PostPosted: Wed 18 Jul 2012 19:07 
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Joined: Tue 19 Jun 2012 20:08
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I agree with hurley that it needs some hard counters. I understand that this ship is supposed to be a good initiator, but there need to be ways around it.

For a start, I don't think force field should be a hard counter. It's already a hard counter to the carrier's bombers/fighters, and a soft/conditional counter to all projectile skills, including torpedoes.

I think a better hard counter would be something like countermeasures. It makes sense that something as sophisticated as a tractor beam requires a good understanding of the location and size of the enemy ship, so breaking that lock should prevent the skill working, or alternatively reduce it's effectiveness. Skills like this, such as hook in dota, generally need to be a skillshot, or alternatively it should be disrupted by creeps or other ships being in the way.

If it's a lock-on click and it works skill, then imho, it should work like a sun, so the target experiences 'gravity' which pulls them towards the science vessel. In that case it increases the mistake a ship heading straight for the science vessel has made, but it would be not impossible to break it by manoeuvring a small ship or using a skill that effects speed.


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PostPosted: Wed 18 Jul 2012 19:35 
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Joined: Fri 9 Mar 2012 01:07
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Liking the sound of the science vessel.

I do have some thoughts about the tractor beam and the pulse wave.

Tractor beam should pull a ship like suns' gravity but with a pull strength that upgrades. It would pull slower than the sun to give the targeted ship time to turn against the pull.

Pulse wave should move the ship quickly, but have a warm up visual so you can see it coming as well as the wave being visible as it travels.

As for the anti base rush, multi-target is a start (I hope you mean large turrets and not just shielded ones), and it should help prevent a cruiser tanking damage for all the team.

The ability of arty to snipe a base on The Hell Pass is a major issue, I pulled into they asteroid field by the base, Reeves build a base on me and we just killed it, voyd soloed the base.

One possible solution would be making the base immune to skill shots, guass, torps, and so on making runs slower. This would help, but would not fully solve the issue.

Just my thoughts, I mainly like the firts two thing on the science vessel.


Suicidal IS my style.

Trollstroyer, Trolltillery, Trollvette, Trollboat, Trollnought.


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PostPosted: Wed 25 Jul 2012 09:02 
Commander

Joined: Mon 31 Oct 2011 23:21
Posts: 90
Location: On your stern
Thanks for the dev's work.

I'm curios, are abilities such as "pulse wave" and "tractor beam" able to target and effect things other then players ships, Such as squadrons (pulse wave pushing them away) asteroids or support's deploy-able turrets. Also in theme of my question can electronic warfare be placed on turrets, effectively deactivating them for the duration?

If not, could you justify why. Such as the closed dev testing experience.

Cheers Tyra

Shas


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PostPosted: Wed 25 Jul 2012 09:24 
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Staff Stellar Impact

Joined: Mon 22 Aug 2011 15:19
Posts: 361
ShasOUdas wrote:
Thanks for the dev's work.

I'm curios, are abilities such as "pulse wave" and "tractor beam" able to target and effect things other then players ships, Such as squadrons (pulse wave pushing them away) asteroids or support's deploy-able turrets. Also in theme of my question can electronic warfare be placed on turrets, effectively deactivating them for the duration?

If not, could you justify why. Such as the closed dev testing experience.

Cheers Tyra

Shas


Hey ShasOUdas,

Well, the skills of the science vessel will only target player's ship. The skills of this ship are based on the jamming of the maneuvering systems.
The role of the science vessel is to disorganize the enemy lines, pull out a targeted ship or anything like that.

For the squadron they don't obey at the same rules as the player's ships. For the asteroids, they cannot be moved, they are part of the environment.

Electronic warfare cannot be launch on a turret, this skill affecting the maneuverability of the ship, they're no interest to do that.

But don't worry the Science vessel have its role in the battle and i think you're gonna like it, i hope.

Have a good day and see you soon in the game. ;)


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